**NS Roleplay Symposium 2017**
LOCATION: Symposium Hall
TOPIC: "Global Economics & Trade: A Primer”
TIME: 7PM Eastern/11PM GMT, Thursday, July 13th
Good evening, everyone. Welcome to "Global Economics & Trade: A Primer”. I’m Swith, your moderator. Our guests are Lamoni, Maltropia, and Kyrusia - experienced in GE&T and ready to answer your questions.
For more information, please visit the GE&T help thread: forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=107737
Guests, please introduce yourselves and tell us a little about what the GE&T subforum means to you.
BEGIN
::
Kyrusia - Today at 7:00 PM
I'm Kyru. Game Mod, N&I RP Mentor specializing in FT, and director of the Mentor Program. Been a while since I've been exceptionally active in GE&T, but I remember a few things; also more than willing to provide insight to it relevant to FT.
Maltropia - Today at 7:01 PM
Good evening, would-be shopkeepers! I'm Maltropa, a Senior N&I Mentor with the second- or third-biggest ego in GE&T. It's the subforum I'm fondest of, since it's where I did most of my NS learning and first became somewhat prominent, so I've always felt a certain connection with, and duty towards, that community.
Lamoni - Today at 7:02 PM
I am Lamoni. I'm an NS Mentor who also specializes in GE&T, and will be backing up Maltropia for this Panel.
Swith - Today at 7:02 PM
Welcome panelists. We'll start with the very basics: What is a storefront?
Maltropia - Today at 7:02 PM
I spelled my own name wrong. It's okay, Maltrópa's the Irish.
Kyrusia - Today at 7:03 PM
Simplest answer? It's a thread where players create a commercial business (hence, storefront, just like a brick-and-mortar in reality) providing products or services that other nations/entities can purchase - ideally through active roleplaying
.
Maltropia - Today at 7:03 PM
A storefront is basically your company's website in NS. It's where you list your products and all the information on your company and provide an interface by which other players' nations, corporations and citizens can interact.
Lamoni - Today at 7:04 PM
A storefront is... very much like a store, but put into a format that the forums will accept. In some ways, it is like an online store catalog. It facilitates the buying and selling of goods and services, and serves as your interface with the rest of NS.
Swith - Today at 7:04 PM
Question Two posed by Ched - "Where should industry and trade be begun to be explained on a MT-PMT level, and even on a FT level? Like where would you personally begin with explaining it for a nation?"
Maltropia - Today at 7:06 PM
Q2: I've never been that coherent when it comes to the economics side of my nations. I start with all these vague ideas and slowly jot them down in diverse places until they morph into a coherent whole. Sometimes, my economy winds up being a product of the storefronts I make - this country has a big airport storefront? okay, it's big into air travel.
Kyrusia - Today at 7:07 PM
Q2: Relative to FT... You're often dealing with commerce on a level that, really, exists for fluff. If we're to just accept the probable, any given star system has enough resources to provide for itself; artificial scarcity and product/service-specific scarcity would of course still be a thing, but there y' go.
Accepting that commerce in FT would generally be fluff, I personally tend to focus on broad strokes first. I tend to make certain assumptions - based on the idea that there are countless NPC states too "small" to be worthy of note (think background characters in a coffee shop; they fill-up space) - regarding this level of trade. For individual other players, I make specifics.
"Who? What? When? Why?" What do they need/want, and what can they provide? Etc.
Macabees - Today at 7:10 PM
Hi, guys. I'm The Macabees. I've dabbled with GE&T, including OPing an old, big storefront that's no longer around (Kriegzimmer). I am an economist/analyst IRL. Q2: I think to some extent your economics are relevant to your political system, so there might be some econ. elements at that level. For example, fascistic countries tend to have a lot of price controls, because they are a part of social controls and they also help protect big local companies that are typical of fascistic oligopolies. Much like how a rich open society will tend to have a more capitalistic economy, or one that's based on property rights (and therefore a "free" price system/pricing process).
All of this being said, it's NationStates, and strict economic realism is not necessarily something that you have to adhere to. But, if that's something that interests you, then there is definitely an economic aspect to your politics.(edited)
Swith - Today at 7:11 PM
Welcome, Macabees!
Question Three posed by Temp - "Do our panelists have any advice for getting started on GE&T? In terms of making a storefront as well as... perusing the wares of our fellow nations."
Maltropia - Today at 7:14 PM
Q3: "Getting started" meaning new to GE&T entirely? It's a tricky enough forum to figure out, sometimes, because it's just so weird relative to the other ones. More than anywhere, I think, the Preview button is your friend. Practice with some of the BBcode and see what works; open the storefronts on the first page and see which look good and then find out why. Don't be afraid to be dangerously unique in what you're trying to sell, and don't be afraid either of starting with something common. Airports and airlines are a very common starting ground, because it's hard to go wrong; but a well-done airport/airline can be a great launching pad for a successful GE&T career.
Macabees - Today at 7:14 PM
Q3: The other panelists definitely have more experience than I do here. Most of my storefront experience was Jolt-era, which if you don't know what that means, trust me it will give you anxiety just learning about Jolt.
But, if I were to offer some advice it'd be to start in a product category that you enjoy. I enjoyed "military design," so that's what my storefront was about. But there are storefronts for civilian airlines, automakers, etc. Your creativity is the limit. Of course, if you go into business -- even if it's NS business -- there's demand as much as there is supply, meaning there's a balance between what you want to provide and what the typical NSer is interesting in 'buying' (or RPing about buying, better said). Selling pens might not be very popular, for example.(edited)
Kyrusia - Today at 7:15 PM
Q3: Personally? I can say what I personally like to see...
Fluff. Thought-out missions and backgrounds for the company, foundation, institute, service provider, etc. I also like details, but not just lists upon lists of numbers. A good graphical presentation, one that fits the products/services being provided.
For FT specifically, as I know they are a fairly small niche on GE&T given most states simply use native hardware and discuss the exchange of services "off-stage": I'd say focus on the fluff, especially. Make the products/services being provided something that they can actively use and, importantly, make an additive edition to their own creations.
If you're providing a security service, for example (thanks to Bakra for this example), let them actually create the sercurity personnel as characters with you. Something they can add to their toybox as more than just a number or a stat on a spreadsheet.
Lamoni - Today at 7:15 PM
The first thing that you want when you are making a storefront on GE&T is a clear idea of what it is that you are going to be selling. Your products are the big draw, after all. Secondly, you are going to want to figure out what you are going to want your storefront to look like. Remember, your storefront is like a sales website for your company, and it should look good. For example, Anemos Major's storefront (https://forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=106279&hilit=Anemos+Major) was somewhat inspired by IKEA catalogs. Thirdly, you'll want to maintain a high level of customer service. Being polite to customers, helping them when they realize that they have made a mistake somewhere, answering questions, and whatever else that that entails. Finally, make sure that you enjoy the kind of storefront that you are making, because it will not last long if you don't.
Swith - Today at 7:15 PM
Question Four posed by Ceneria - "You have all been involved in GE&T for ages, through a rather massive range of storefronts and programs. In your collective experiences interacting with experienced and new GE&Ters alike, what have you found to be the single most important piece of advice, both to new and experienced players?"
Macabees - Today at 7:16 PM
Q4: Don't let your storefront run your OOC life.
Kyrusia - Today at 7:17 PM
Q4: Figure out the actual price yourself; don't rely on the purchaser. It's an additive service; I'd also say it makes a difference. ;P
Lamoni - Today at 7:17 PM
Q4: Don't let your storefront consume you. Know when it is time to take a step back, and ponder over whether your storefront is something that you want to keep working on or not. As Mac said, don't let it run your OOC life.
Maltropia - Today at 7:17 PM
Q4: There's a whole slew of things I could say here. I could say "learn the BBcode," "advertise like mad," or "hit the Preview button like it just insulted your mother."
Really, though, the best piece of advice is networking. Establish yourself not by being self-contained but by going to other people. Make friends, both in- and out- of character. Become a repeat customer. It'll get you customers in return.
Swith - Today at 7:18 PM
Question Five posed by Eridani Imperium - "How would you create a currency for use in GE&T?"
Expanding that a little - "Also, how do you know exchange rates, how do you determine how much your nation has (to avoid number wanking), and how does money change hands?"
Macabees - Today at 7:19 PM
Q5: As an economist, I recommend not messing with exchange rates too much. They're a complicated thing and we're not equipped on NS to talk about them objectively, because they're very much a 'spontaneous' thing, meaning that exchange rates are a product of so many different factors.
Typically, the work around is to use the 'NSD', or the NationStates Dollar. It's a universal currency that helps keep prices straight and relatively comparable.
Kyrusia - Today at 7:20 PM
Q5: Predominantly, GE&T use NationStates Dollar or Universal Standard Dollar - both of which have, over the years, largely been assumed to be a stand-in for the United States Dollar in value (the latter even mimics its initialism). Some FTers will also use Galactic Standard Credit (GSC), just to maintain the sci-fi aesthetic, though I've seen this used far more often in overt storytelling than in storefronts.
As for exchange rates, I yield to Mac's expertise here, spare I would advise not trying to artificially force currency usage on others. The sale/purchase of specie as a commodity is also a fairly complicated practice - and something I imagine only a few NSers have ever even dabbled in.
Maltropia - Today at 7:21 PM
Q5b (because a's a bit out of my area): I don't know exchange rates, I just peg my currency to the NSD (which stands for one of a few things), the default currency we most often use in GE&T. Determining how much money you have is also surprisingly unimportant, because most governments are spending money they don't have - credit and debt are essential parts of global economics. The best advice, in general, is to be reasonable when it comes to making yourself rich.
Lamoni - Today at 7:21 PM
Q5: I find it much easier to just use the Standard Dollar, and not worry about exchange rates. It is just an extra complication that most really don't need.
Maltropia - Today at 7:21 PM
^
Kyrusia - Today at 7:22 PM
It's one of those handwaved mechanics that gets used "just cause." xP
Maltropia - Today at 7:22 PM
I do occasionally list a price in my own currency, for my entertainment and authenticity, but never without NSD accompanying.
Swith - Today at 7:22 PM
Question Six posed by Ched - "Ideally, how should players post about wanting to buy something from a storefront, how should the RP be played out?
Kyrusia - Today at 7:22 PM
I'll sit this one out; I need to get up for a moment anyway.
Maltropia - Today at 7:23 PM
Q6: I always just do it as a letter. I've gotten very good at writing business-formal, I think. I'm pretty sure there's a nice guide somewhere as well, which I'll track down before Q7 arrives. Since most storefronts have a catalogue, your letter boils down to:
"Dear sir,
We would like to buy six flower baskets,
Yours,
Mal Tropia."
How much you embellish that is up to you, but consider the tone and length of any letters you've ever gotten from businesses - electricity providers, phone services, etc.
Lamoni - Today at 7:24 PM
This is just my opinion, but I like to see GE&T orders that look like someone actually made a professional looking letter or e-mail to the storefront/company in question, where they detail what it is that they want to buy, any questions that they might have, and so on. It shows that you respect the person running the storefront enough to actually put effort into your posts, thereby helping the aesthetic of the storefront as well (a bigger deal than most would think).
Kyrusia - Today at 7:24 PM
And now there'll be a boom of flourist storefronts; they'll push-out the airports, I just know it! :m_sarcasm:
Swith - Today at 7:24 PM
Question Seven posed by Nikolia - "What should, in panelists opinion, be the useful mechanism against "one-liner" posts or just simply filled out applications without proper IC letter on a storefront?"
Maltropia - Today at 7:25 PM
Aforementioned letter-writing guide - forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic.php?p=7030363#p7030363 - bit dated now, but it gives you an idea of the minimum expectations.
Kyrusia - Today at 7:26 PM
Q7: Have a roleplayed response be a requirement for involvement, just like you would any other thread. If that doesn't work, you can always request their posts be removed. We get a fair share of these requests in the Mod megathreads relevant to them.
Lamoni - Today at 7:26 PM
^
And state it clearly in your storefront, so that people know!(edited)
Make it visible.
Maltropia - Today at 7:27 PM
Q7: As Kyrusia says, one method is the "please only apply with a letter," and then proceeding to ignore anyone who fails that requirement. I don't like that, though, because it strikes me as unprofessional. Just because your customers don't meet the standard you'd like doesn't mean that you should be rude or fail to meet your own standards. Everyone deserves a polite and formal response, even if it's an IC version of "please write a letter next time and then we'll say yes."
Swith - Today at 7:27 PM
Question Eight posed by Nikolia - "Since Malt said "advertise like mad", what are the good ways of advertising your storefront(s)?"
Kyrusia - Today at 7:28 PM
Ones that don't involve spamming and giving the Mods more work. :stuck_out_tongue:
Maltropia - Today at 7:28 PM
Q8: Depending on how you look at this, it could be either boring-copy-paste time or awesome-sneak-peek-of-my-Guide time:
"Go out to relevant storefronts and offer them your product. If you run a ship-building company, look for shipping companies. If you sell handwoven baskets, look for companies that sell shampoos or fruit. Sometimes you might look to establish a long-term partnership with that storefront, and become the sole supplier of baskets to Fruits'R'Us. Other times you might just want to make a once-off sale, possibly hoping to get a repeat customer out of them but not expecting to sell more than three tugboats.
Sometimes there can be a fine line between advertising and spam. It's important that your posts be relevant to the threads where you put them: you wouldn't advertise an airport to an arms dealer, most likely, or vice versa. Engage with the storefront. Don't just post an advertisement, write a letter. Even if you copy-paste that letter every subsequent time you use it and only change a few of the words around, it makes you look better and it makes the storefront you're posting on it look better.
In fact, you should strive to always include a cover letter in GE&T, whether you're making an inquiry, selling a boat, applying for an airline route or accepting someone's order. It's good business and good etiquette. "
Kyrusia - Today at 7:28 PM
(Also, sigs are your friend.)
Macabees - Today at 7:29 PM
Q8: I think as Mal had said in an earlier question, the best form of marketing is relationship building, or networking. It's not just true on NS, but in RL too. When I build a strategy for a client to market on social media, what that really means is that I build them an approach to building a community around the product that they sell. A community where they're not selling, though, but instead they're adding value. If you add enough value, you will sell without having to hard sell.
Maltropia - Today at 7:29 PM
^
I've had people come to me (hi, @tect!) to buy from my storefronts because they remembered that I had storefronts selling something they should buy. Friendship truly is magic.
Lamoni - Today at 7:30 PM
1.) Don't be afraid to advertise your storefront in your signature. 2.) Seek out companies on GE&T who would likely buy your product, and offer it to them via TG. 3.) Relationship build! 4.) If you see a thread on GE&T where someone is asking for your type of product, feel free to respond in that thread.
Swith - Today at 7:30 PM
Question Nine posed by Jutomi~ [restructured by mod] - "What makes a player a good customer, and what are some habits that make players a bad customer?"
Kyrusia - Today at 7:31 PM
Q9: One that is in it for more than adding n-number of tanks to their spreadsheet, or more than buying "OVER 9,000! SHOOTY-SHOOTIES!" One that treats the storefront as it should be: like any other roleplay.
For bad? ...That should be obvious. :stuck_out_tongue:
Macabees - Today at 7:31 PM
Q9: Not summing up the total value of their orders. That was one my personal pet peeves . Maybe it was just me.
Maltropia - Today at 7:33 PM
Q9: A good customer, to me, is someone who reads the storefront, puts work into his letters and considers his IC reasons for going through with whatever purchase or action he's undertaking.
A bad customer fails to meet those criteria; repeated, low-quality posts, or posts for the sake of posting, which some storefront owners might accept as free bumps but which others might see as diminishing the overall quality and appearance of the storefront. We get snobby about our own stuff sometimes.
Lamoni - Today at 7:33 PM
Q9: You aren't alone there, Mac. A customer should really avoid one-liners like the plague, though. Like we said earlier, please, please, please put effort into your orders! Second, be polite, and realize that this isn't about putting X number of tanks (or whatever) into slot Y of your personal spreadsheet. A good customer will read the storefront, reads the product descriptions, and considers all this in light of their IC needs.
Kyrusia - Today at 7:33 PM
I'd rather have 3 quality orders, than 30 one-liners worth of bump-spam and more "profit."
Swith - Today at 7:34 PM
Question Ten posed by Ceneria - "Last year (before I dropped off the earth for a bit), I noticed there was an increasing movement of storefronts which did not include order forms. The stated goal of many of these storefronts was to encourage potential customers to RP a letter to the storefront regarding their order. Do you think this is an effective way to encourage RP within the GE&T community, and if so, what sort of balance do you think exists between risking alienating newcomers by not having forms and encouraging IC interactions by requiring formal letters?"
Maltropia - Today at 7:37 PM
Q10: Oh, that's a nice question. I think it's for the better, generally, but I can see downsides too. The lack of order forms means that you can't take the easy way out and make a drive-by purchase (a drive-buy?) where you copy-paste a form, lazily fill in your name and a number and then never revisit it. I like to think that it's led to me getting more out of my own storefront-management, since my responses nowadays nearly always include some unique lines in them responding to something contained in the applications.
Of course, it might also have the drawback of reducing activity since the lazier people (of which I'm often one, not gonna lie) have to spend more time engaging than they really care to.
Swith - Today at 7:37 PM
Question 11 posed by Nikolia - "Are there some formatting tricks panelists commonly use?"
Lamoni - Today at 7:37 PM
The reason why forms were first put into storefronts was to give people a reason to do more than just post one-liners. So to expand on that and require IC letters and such is simply taking it a step beyond that. You (hopefully) wouldn't post a one-liner response in the middle of someone's roleplay, so why do it in GE&T? The community should strive for more. On the other hand, it will reduce activity.
Kyrusia - Today at 7:37 PM
Q11: Transparencies in graphics! xD
Maltropia - Today at 7:37 PM
Q11: I said specific formatting questions, Nik! This is too vague!
Swith - Today at 7:38 PM
laughs
Maltropia - Today at 7:40 PM
I love blocktext and align=justify, as I said in an earlier panel. I use them just about everywhere and almost always together, from narrative prose to government communiques. I also use anchor and various lists and links ([post] is a nice, clean link-maker) to construct my navigation bars and tables of contents.
The [ hr][/ hr] code is a great one, as well, for tidying up storefronts, as are things like box and the floatleft/right commands. I dislike tables because they're not very flexible and a lot of people misuse them, but I have seen them put to fantastic use.
Font size is also something worth fiddling with; it's scientifically proven that 50% of storefronts could be improved by being font size 105%.
Swith - Today at 7:40 PM
Question Twelve posed by Eridani Imperium - "What's the panelists' advice on making products to sell?"
Lamoni - Today at 7:43 PM
Take the time to research what you're selling first (even if it is a "rule of cool" product). Secondly ask yourself: "is this going to be something that I will enjoy making for sale?" Products in which serious thought are put into them are always better than products where thought was clearly not put into them. Third, don't just sell RL weapons. There is a rule of thumb on NS and GE&T that everyone has access to RL weapons if they have a good backstory for how they got them, so there is no need for a GE&T storefront to sell them. In other words, make something original.
Maltropia - Today at 7:43 PM
Q12: Write what you know. Don't try to sell something about which you know nothing. I've made that mistake a few times; the storefront looks great until someone comes along asking how the product works and I just have to shrug maniacally.
Swith - Today at 7:43 PM
Question Thirteen is in two parts:
13A posed by Tilt - "How much crossover is there between GE&T and another board? For example, as tied to politics."
13B posed by Ched - "Following up Tilt's question, should a storefront's success or failure affect a nation elsewhere in N&I?"
Kyrusia - Today at 7:45 PM
A particular blockade, anyone?
Maltropia - Today at 7:45 PM
Yeah, I'm thinking it too Kyrusia .
Lamoni - Today at 7:45 PM
It depends on the person running the storefront. While it is one company (or conglomerate) out of many of them that your nation likely has, it can also be a form of advertising if you have a good newspaper or TV News thread, and make posts about your storefront. Yes, also "a particular blockcade."
Maltropia - Today at 7:46 PM
Q13A: It's up to you. Most of my storefronts on the nation Maltropia are just going towards creating a complete picture of Maltropia and have had very little to do with its political development (although my military allies have been known to buy from my storefronts; that's probably more 'networking' again), but in my nation of Cadenza the only storefront is the chamber of commerce bringing in foreign investors. That one thread has defined Cadenza's economy and its position within the region more than anything else I've done with the place.
Swith - Today at 7:47 PM
A quick request for clarification: Storefronts are mostly companies founded within your NS nation, correct? There might be a few public sector things, but it's mostly private industry?
Maltropia - Today at 7:47 PM
Q13B: Considering that everything in NS is collaborative and cooperative - it's up to other people. There was a blockade some years back within a prominent region that led to a prominent GE&Ter closing down his bank, and the IC repercussions were immense. Those repercussions were all consensual by dozens of nations, but you can't force anyone to take a hit just because you did.
Yeah, more or less, though you'd be surprised how often government ministries and military tenders feature.
Kyrusia - Today at 7:48 PM
I'd say it's a mixed bag. I've seen quite a few public/public-private partnership storefronts.
Maltropia - Today at 7:48 PM
My brain just tried to deny the existence of the public sector.
Lamoni - Today at 7:48 PM
Maltropia - Today at 7:48 PM
I'm too libertarian.
Swith - Today at 7:49 PM
Question Fourteen posed by Ceneria - "For at least some storefronts, keeping in the public eye requires being on the first page of the subforum. How can a storefront owner go about bumping their storefront without posting blantantly obvious bumps, or (even better), how can one keep their storefront's name out there even if it falls off to 4+ pages back?"
Kyrusia - Today at 7:49 PM
Shhh. It's okay, Malt. Your inner Austrian will survive.
Q14: Actually "bump" with pertinent content.
A well-written advertisement, announcement of a sale or discount period, something that makes a qualitative addition to the experience and the thread as a whole. That goes for pretty much any "bumps" on NS.
Maltropia - Today at 7:50 PM
Q14: Kyrusia's explained in the main chat that my favourite method of bumping is possibly a warnable offence, so uhhhh
Lamoni - Today at 7:50 PM
Once you get to a certain point, word of mouth takes over, and people will remember your storefront through thick and thin. The hard part, is reaching that level.
Swith - Today at 7:51 PM
Another request for clarification: "Wot's a 'particular blockade'?"
Maltropia - Today at 7:51 PM
If you have GE&T friends (or non-GE&Ters!) there's nothing wrong with asking them to post in your storefront, no more than there is with inviting someone to join your roleplay. If you need a bump that doesn't look like it came from you, ask someone. Heck, ask me if you want.
Kyrusia - Today at 7:51 PM
shoves everyone else to answer the clarifying one.
Maltropia - Today at 7:51 PM
falls and hurts himself
Lamoni - Today at 7:51 PM
falls to the ground
Swith - Today at 7:52 PM
crickets Anybody? :stuck_out_tongue:
There we go!
Lamoni - Today at 7:53 PM
Kyru was going to answer that question.
Maltropia - Today at 7:53 PM
bleeds as Kyrusia types
Kyrusia - Today at 7:53 PM
The blockade, as I recall, involved the termination of a certain bank's business, resulting in the near-total financial collapse of MT/PMT NS due to the storefront's popularity. This resulted of an attempting invasion of the region the bank owner was in. At least if I remember correctly. It's been a long time.(edited)
Big community event thing.
Maltropia - Today at 7:54 PM
Someone got absolutely glassed in the same thread.
i.e. nukes.
Kyrusia - Today at 7:54 PM
I'm sure others can provide greater details.
Swith - Today at 7:54 PM
Question Fifteen posed by Ched - [mod rephrasing] "How sensible is it for someone to make a puppet nation just to have a storefront, like an East India Company? Could making one be over doing it?"
Maltropia - Today at 7:55 PM
I think it's a bit silly, but some very successful storefronts have done it. Not a huge number, mind you.
I do have 70 puppets, though, so my opinion here is hilarious.
Kyrusia - Today at 7:55 PM
Q15: I've seen it done and, personally, it doesn't really bother me. Though I do hate when people do it and provide no indication as to where the company originates.
Macabees - Today at 7:56 PM
Q15: Maybe a bit tangential, but I do know players who run parts of their nation as they would a storefront - for example, their entire militaries might be private military corps that they rent out to people.
Swith - Today at 7:56 PM
Question Sixteen posed by Nikolia - "How do you see the importance of good graphical illustrations on storefronts, and how they can impact sales?"
Lamoni - Today at 7:57 PM
Good graphics on your storefront can REALLY increase sales. They are like candy or crack for the eyes.
Kyrusia - Today at 7:57 PM
^
Macabees - Today at 7:57 PM
Q16: I feel that they do impact sales quite a bit. I'm not a very good drawer, but for a while I was getting pretty good at drawing tanks (I was no Anemos, mind you) and if the drawing was good people would order it before I had even written anything.
Kyrusia - Today at 7:58 PM
LEGAL ADDICTIVE GRAPHICS. APPLY DIRECTLY TO THE CORNEA.
LEGAL ADDICTIVE GRAPHICS. APPLY DIRECTLY TO THE CORNEA.
LEGAL ADDICTIVE GRAPHICS. APPLY DIRECTLY TO THE CORNEA.
Maltropia - Today at 7:58 PM
Q16: I think good graphics can be make-or-break for a lot of storefronts. Back when I was starting out a "good" storefront only needed one or two pictures, but nowadays it's the standard to not only have pretty pictures but to have made the graphics yourself. Ask yourself whether you'd rather buy from a website written only in the HTML a guy learned on his first day or from a modern graphic designer-designed website; the difference isn't quite that startling, but it's often the storefronts with good graphics that also have good written content, so they're barometers for each other.
Swith - Today at 7:59 PM
Question Seventeen posed by Tilt [clarified by mod] - "Sometimes in P2TM we see parodies. Is it possible in GE&T to parody a real world store and/or parody a real world product. If so, how? Best one seen?"
THIRTY MINUTES, GUESTS
Maltropia - Today at 7:59 PM
Q18: @akimonad had uneasyJet. I was a fan.(edited)
Maltropia - Today at 8:00 PM
18? I'm turning into Swith. 17*.
Kyrusia - Today at 8:00 PM
Wasn't there a storefront dedicated entirely to selling No.2 pencils?
Lamoni - Today at 8:01 PM
Someone else had an airline where people were packed into the plane like cattle, and there were no seats, too.
And yes, Kyru. There was.
There was also the "Tactical Rock."
Maltropia - Today at 8:01 PM
Milograd had a very successful storefront for a while selling the Tactical Rock. Parodies of RL concepts and businesses aren't rare, and when done right they can be hilarious. Absolutely worth giving a go.
Swith - Today at 8:01 PM
Question Eighteen posed by Esc - "If one mark of a good storefront is creating an air of authenticity, what information or elements have you found to be most crucial?"
Maltropia - Today at 8:04 PM
Q18: There are a few sections I think every storefront needs, just as a starting point. "About Us"/"History", a catalogue, ordering/pricing information; those are fundamental, to me, but GE&T is about thinking outside the box and I wouldn't be surprised if someone here went and made a fantastic storefront that managed to include none of those.
Swith - Today at 8:04 PM
Question Nineteen posed by Nikolia - "What are the panelists' opinions on having a separate thread (or threads) as catalogues of products?"
Kyrusia - Today at 8:05 PM
Q19: I'm not a huge fan of having individual threads for individual products. For sections of products in a storefront, though, such as an actual catalogue, I don't mind. I've seen them used fairly successfully.
Maltropia - Today at 8:06 PM
Q19: I'm not sure if I've ever done it, but I see no problem with it when it's not done to extremes. Some miltech guys like to do an individual thread for each tank - but those tanks have write-ups in the tens of thousands of words, and putting two tanks in one thread would be surprisingly cluttered. Generally speaking I think one external catalogue is the most you need. I usually keep it all in the one thread, personally.
Swith - Today at 8:06 PM
Question Twenty posed by Ceneria - "If you had the opportunity to give single piece of advice to every new storefront owner about making their storefront better than average, what would it be? Coding? Content? Style?"
Lamoni - Today at 8:06 PM
All of the above? :wink:
Kyrusia - Today at 8:07 PM
Q20: Don't be upset if your first ten storefronts fail. Keep at it. Keep practicing.(edited)
Lamoni - Today at 8:07 PM
But seriously, you want to make your storefront catch the customer's eye, while having the content to keep them coming back.
Maltropia - Today at 8:08 PM
The key to success in GE&T is experimentation. There are dotted lines you can colour inside, if you want, but it's easy enough to colour over them. There are plenty of boxes in GE&T, and you're free to think outside any and all of them. See what works for other people and then see what works for you.
Swith - Today at 8:08 PM
Question Twenty-One posed by Ched - "What were some notable storefronts you can recall for being either good or bad, and why?"
Maltropia - Today at 8:10 PM
Q20: I don't want to name names in relation to either, actually, because some of the best storefronts were made by people who subsequently tore them up and set a not-so-great example.
Lamoni - Today at 8:10 PM
^
Maltropia - Today at 8:10 PM
Eslovakia's Karlberg AB was a magnificent storefront, though. Serious graphic work there supporting some great products.
Swith - Today at 8:11 PM
Question Twenty-Two posed by Ceneria - "What has been the best community interaction that you've experienced in your time RPing in GE&T?"
Maltropia - Today at 8:12 PM
Q22: I briefly revived the "Bureau for the Improvement of NS Business", or whatever its name was, a while ago, and it was great to see the veterans of the community all chip in to offer advice and help to anyone who asked for it.
Other side of that coin: I've sued people a few times and gotten really snarky about it, IC. Great times there.
Lamoni - Today at 8:12 PM
Time to bring the Bureau back, Malt.
Swith - Today at 8:12 PM
Request for clarification: "Sue? Is there an NS court?"
Lamoni - Today at 8:13 PM
No, it is all done IC.
Maltropia - Today at 8:13 PM
Well, rather, I've had my companies' lawyers shout down other people.
Some regions do have courts, but I've never seen one used in a GE&T context. Now there's a nice idea...
Kyrusia - Today at 8:14 PM
The glories of an IC cease and desist. For the record though... If it's actually actionable, report it, don't sue. :stuck_out_tongue:
Swith - Today at 8:14 PM
Question Twenty-Three posed by Lubyak - "Storefronts are the most popular way of engaging in GE&T. Do you think there's potential for other forms of engagement? (i.e. Freed trade organizations, customs unions, investment treaties, etc.)"
Kyrusia - Today at 8:15 PM
Q23: I've seen the occasional organizational threads in GE&T; I think they're sometimes a mixed bag in terms of quality, however, but I would definitely say there is room for them.
Maltropia - Today at 8:15 PM
Q23: I've participated in the odd trade summit in GE&T, actually. Yeah, plenty of room for it and no reason not to try; the only issue is that there isn't quite the culture behind them to give them a helpful head start, so it might be an uphill battle if you're aspiring.(edited)
13? Jeez.
Swith - Today at 8:16 PM
Question Twenty-Four posed by Ched - "Are trade wars a thing that happen often in GE&T? And do some players add conflict like for example having their workers do a general strike?" [Would such a strike be played out in GE&T subforum or in the N&I RP subs?](edited)
Kyrusia - Today at 8:16 PM
Q23: If it's a war, I'd say it need be played out in II, much like the blockade and subsequent actions were.
An actual war, I should clarify.
Since resource wars are a thing.
Maltropia - Today at 8:17 PM
Q24: Jeez none of us can get numbers right. I don't really see that happen. Again, I think the culture of GE&T has evolved into a storefront focus and could possibly do with some steering away from that. Actual conflict doesn't really belong in GE&T, but interactions with storefronts probably almost universally do.
Swith - Today at 8:18 PM
Question Twenty-Five posed by PM - "Is there such a thing on GE&T as a 'saturated' market, where people just don't want to see another thread selling [x product]?"(edited)
Maltropia - Today at 8:19 PM
Q25: Considering the longevity of the airport/line craze? Probably not. Very often, though, someone comes up with something no one's doing (even something as 'mainstream' as supermarkets) and suddenly half a dozen copycats emerge before they all drop off the face of the earth.
Kyrusia - Today at 8:20 PM
Suddenly not!Starbucks. Suddenly not!Starbucks everywhere.
Swith - Today at 8:20 PM
Question Twenty-Six posed by Ched - "What's your favorite part of GE&T?"
Maltropia - Today at 8:22 PM
Q26: The creativity of its members. I've seen some wonderfully innovative storefronts in my years in GE&T, and some brilliantly-designed ways of selling products. It's amazing how just about anything can be made tantalising by a good storefront and good storefront-owner.
Lamoni - Today at 8:23 PM
Same
Swith - Today at 8:23 PM
FINAL QUESTION posed by PM - "Can you link an example of your own storefront, and why you're proud of it, or tell us things you wish you could have done better?"
Maltropia - Today at 8:23 PM
FQ: Yes I can. Will I, though?
forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=390466
This is T-O Cartographic. It's the first new storefront I've made in about three, four years now, after a long lull. It's probably not my best but it's the one I'm proudest of, even though it's not yet gotten a customer. It's 95% finished, but I took so long getting to this point that it's about twenty pages back so no one's seen it without me shoving it in their faces. It's probably the most realistic storefront I've made, partly because it's based on my own experiences as a geography student. I wish I could figure out a third paragraph for "Our Innovation" though. :stuck_out_tongue:
Swith - Today at 8:26 PM
Thanks, Malt!
Thank you, Panelists! This wraps up tonight's 7PM panel.
Our upcoming schedule:
Tonight:
Worldbuilding and Related (Late Hour) — 9PM Eastern/1AM GMT
NS Roleplay Symposium 2017
TOPIC: "Global Economics & Trade: A Primer”
TIME: COMPLETED
LOCATION: Symposium Hall
TOPIC: "Global Economics & Trade: A Primer”
TIME: 7PM Eastern/11PM GMT, Thursday, July 13th
Good evening, everyone. Welcome to "Global Economics & Trade: A Primer”. I’m Swith, your moderator. Our guests are Lamoni, Maltropia, and Kyrusia - experienced in GE&T and ready to answer your questions.
For more information, please visit the GE&T help thread: forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=107737
Guests, please introduce yourselves and tell us a little about what the GE&T subforum means to you.
BEGIN
::
Kyrusia - Today at 7:00 PM
I'm Kyru. Game Mod, N&I RP Mentor specializing in FT, and director of the Mentor Program. Been a while since I've been exceptionally active in GE&T, but I remember a few things; also more than willing to provide insight to it relevant to FT.
Maltropia - Today at 7:01 PM
Good evening, would-be shopkeepers! I'm Maltropa, a Senior N&I Mentor with the second- or third-biggest ego in GE&T. It's the subforum I'm fondest of, since it's where I did most of my NS learning and first became somewhat prominent, so I've always felt a certain connection with, and duty towards, that community.
Lamoni - Today at 7:02 PM
I am Lamoni. I'm an NS Mentor who also specializes in GE&T, and will be backing up Maltropia for this Panel.
Swith - Today at 7:02 PM
Welcome panelists. We'll start with the very basics: What is a storefront?
Maltropia - Today at 7:02 PM
I spelled my own name wrong. It's okay, Maltrópa's the Irish.
Kyrusia - Today at 7:03 PM
Simplest answer? It's a thread where players create a commercial business (hence, storefront, just like a brick-and-mortar in reality) providing products or services that other nations/entities can purchase - ideally through active roleplaying
.
Maltropia - Today at 7:03 PM
A storefront is basically your company's website in NS. It's where you list your products and all the information on your company and provide an interface by which other players' nations, corporations and citizens can interact.
Lamoni - Today at 7:04 PM
A storefront is... very much like a store, but put into a format that the forums will accept. In some ways, it is like an online store catalog. It facilitates the buying and selling of goods and services, and serves as your interface with the rest of NS.
Swith - Today at 7:04 PM
Question Two posed by Ched - "Where should industry and trade be begun to be explained on a MT-PMT level, and even on a FT level? Like where would you personally begin with explaining it for a nation?"
Maltropia - Today at 7:06 PM
Q2: I've never been that coherent when it comes to the economics side of my nations. I start with all these vague ideas and slowly jot them down in diverse places until they morph into a coherent whole. Sometimes, my economy winds up being a product of the storefronts I make - this country has a big airport storefront? okay, it's big into air travel.
Kyrusia - Today at 7:07 PM
Q2: Relative to FT... You're often dealing with commerce on a level that, really, exists for fluff. If we're to just accept the probable, any given star system has enough resources to provide for itself; artificial scarcity and product/service-specific scarcity would of course still be a thing, but there y' go.
Accepting that commerce in FT would generally be fluff, I personally tend to focus on broad strokes first. I tend to make certain assumptions - based on the idea that there are countless NPC states too "small" to be worthy of note (think background characters in a coffee shop; they fill-up space) - regarding this level of trade. For individual other players, I make specifics.
"Who? What? When? Why?" What do they need/want, and what can they provide? Etc.
Macabees - Today at 7:10 PM
Hi, guys. I'm The Macabees. I've dabbled with GE&T, including OPing an old, big storefront that's no longer around (Kriegzimmer). I am an economist/analyst IRL. Q2: I think to some extent your economics are relevant to your political system, so there might be some econ. elements at that level. For example, fascistic countries tend to have a lot of price controls, because they are a part of social controls and they also help protect big local companies that are typical of fascistic oligopolies. Much like how a rich open society will tend to have a more capitalistic economy, or one that's based on property rights (and therefore a "free" price system/pricing process).
All of this being said, it's NationStates, and strict economic realism is not necessarily something that you have to adhere to. But, if that's something that interests you, then there is definitely an economic aspect to your politics.(edited)
Swith - Today at 7:11 PM
Welcome, Macabees!
Question Three posed by Temp - "Do our panelists have any advice for getting started on GE&T? In terms of making a storefront as well as... perusing the wares of our fellow nations."
Maltropia - Today at 7:14 PM
Q3: "Getting started" meaning new to GE&T entirely? It's a tricky enough forum to figure out, sometimes, because it's just so weird relative to the other ones. More than anywhere, I think, the Preview button is your friend. Practice with some of the BBcode and see what works; open the storefronts on the first page and see which look good and then find out why. Don't be afraid to be dangerously unique in what you're trying to sell, and don't be afraid either of starting with something common. Airports and airlines are a very common starting ground, because it's hard to go wrong; but a well-done airport/airline can be a great launching pad for a successful GE&T career.
Macabees - Today at 7:14 PM
Q3: The other panelists definitely have more experience than I do here. Most of my storefront experience was Jolt-era, which if you don't know what that means, trust me it will give you anxiety just learning about Jolt.
But, if I were to offer some advice it'd be to start in a product category that you enjoy. I enjoyed "military design," so that's what my storefront was about. But there are storefronts for civilian airlines, automakers, etc. Your creativity is the limit. Of course, if you go into business -- even if it's NS business -- there's demand as much as there is supply, meaning there's a balance between what you want to provide and what the typical NSer is interesting in 'buying' (or RPing about buying, better said). Selling pens might not be very popular, for example.(edited)
Kyrusia - Today at 7:15 PM
Q3: Personally? I can say what I personally like to see...
Fluff. Thought-out missions and backgrounds for the company, foundation, institute, service provider, etc. I also like details, but not just lists upon lists of numbers. A good graphical presentation, one that fits the products/services being provided.
For FT specifically, as I know they are a fairly small niche on GE&T given most states simply use native hardware and discuss the exchange of services "off-stage": I'd say focus on the fluff, especially. Make the products/services being provided something that they can actively use and, importantly, make an additive edition to their own creations.
If you're providing a security service, for example (thanks to Bakra for this example), let them actually create the sercurity personnel as characters with you. Something they can add to their toybox as more than just a number or a stat on a spreadsheet.
Lamoni - Today at 7:15 PM
The first thing that you want when you are making a storefront on GE&T is a clear idea of what it is that you are going to be selling. Your products are the big draw, after all. Secondly, you are going to want to figure out what you are going to want your storefront to look like. Remember, your storefront is like a sales website for your company, and it should look good. For example, Anemos Major's storefront (https://forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=106279&hilit=Anemos+Major) was somewhat inspired by IKEA catalogs. Thirdly, you'll want to maintain a high level of customer service. Being polite to customers, helping them when they realize that they have made a mistake somewhere, answering questions, and whatever else that that entails. Finally, make sure that you enjoy the kind of storefront that you are making, because it will not last long if you don't.
Swith - Today at 7:15 PM
Question Four posed by Ceneria - "You have all been involved in GE&T for ages, through a rather massive range of storefronts and programs. In your collective experiences interacting with experienced and new GE&Ters alike, what have you found to be the single most important piece of advice, both to new and experienced players?"
Macabees - Today at 7:16 PM
Q4: Don't let your storefront run your OOC life.
Kyrusia - Today at 7:17 PM
Q4: Figure out the actual price yourself; don't rely on the purchaser. It's an additive service; I'd also say it makes a difference. ;P
Lamoni - Today at 7:17 PM
Q4: Don't let your storefront consume you. Know when it is time to take a step back, and ponder over whether your storefront is something that you want to keep working on or not. As Mac said, don't let it run your OOC life.
Maltropia - Today at 7:17 PM
Q4: There's a whole slew of things I could say here. I could say "learn the BBcode," "advertise like mad," or "hit the Preview button like it just insulted your mother."
Really, though, the best piece of advice is networking. Establish yourself not by being self-contained but by going to other people. Make friends, both in- and out- of character. Become a repeat customer. It'll get you customers in return.
Swith - Today at 7:18 PM
Question Five posed by Eridani Imperium - "How would you create a currency for use in GE&T?"
Expanding that a little - "Also, how do you know exchange rates, how do you determine how much your nation has (to avoid number wanking), and how does money change hands?"
Macabees - Today at 7:19 PM
Q5: As an economist, I recommend not messing with exchange rates too much. They're a complicated thing and we're not equipped on NS to talk about them objectively, because they're very much a 'spontaneous' thing, meaning that exchange rates are a product of so many different factors.
Typically, the work around is to use the 'NSD', or the NationStates Dollar. It's a universal currency that helps keep prices straight and relatively comparable.
Kyrusia - Today at 7:20 PM
Q5: Predominantly, GE&T use NationStates Dollar or Universal Standard Dollar - both of which have, over the years, largely been assumed to be a stand-in for the United States Dollar in value (the latter even mimics its initialism). Some FTers will also use Galactic Standard Credit (GSC), just to maintain the sci-fi aesthetic, though I've seen this used far more often in overt storytelling than in storefronts.
As for exchange rates, I yield to Mac's expertise here, spare I would advise not trying to artificially force currency usage on others. The sale/purchase of specie as a commodity is also a fairly complicated practice - and something I imagine only a few NSers have ever even dabbled in.
Maltropia - Today at 7:21 PM
Q5b (because a's a bit out of my area): I don't know exchange rates, I just peg my currency to the NSD (which stands for one of a few things), the default currency we most often use in GE&T. Determining how much money you have is also surprisingly unimportant, because most governments are spending money they don't have - credit and debt are essential parts of global economics. The best advice, in general, is to be reasonable when it comes to making yourself rich.
Lamoni - Today at 7:21 PM
Q5: I find it much easier to just use the Standard Dollar, and not worry about exchange rates. It is just an extra complication that most really don't need.
Maltropia - Today at 7:21 PM
^
Kyrusia - Today at 7:22 PM
It's one of those handwaved mechanics that gets used "just cause." xP
Maltropia - Today at 7:22 PM
I do occasionally list a price in my own currency, for my entertainment and authenticity, but never without NSD accompanying.
Swith - Today at 7:22 PM
Question Six posed by Ched - "Ideally, how should players post about wanting to buy something from a storefront, how should the RP be played out?
Kyrusia - Today at 7:22 PM
I'll sit this one out; I need to get up for a moment anyway.
Maltropia - Today at 7:23 PM
Q6: I always just do it as a letter. I've gotten very good at writing business-formal, I think. I'm pretty sure there's a nice guide somewhere as well, which I'll track down before Q7 arrives. Since most storefronts have a catalogue, your letter boils down to:
"Dear sir,
We would like to buy six flower baskets,
Yours,
Mal Tropia."
How much you embellish that is up to you, but consider the tone and length of any letters you've ever gotten from businesses - electricity providers, phone services, etc.
Lamoni - Today at 7:24 PM
This is just my opinion, but I like to see GE&T orders that look like someone actually made a professional looking letter or e-mail to the storefront/company in question, where they detail what it is that they want to buy, any questions that they might have, and so on. It shows that you respect the person running the storefront enough to actually put effort into your posts, thereby helping the aesthetic of the storefront as well (a bigger deal than most would think).
Kyrusia - Today at 7:24 PM
And now there'll be a boom of flourist storefronts; they'll push-out the airports, I just know it! :m_sarcasm:
Swith - Today at 7:24 PM
Question Seven posed by Nikolia - "What should, in panelists opinion, be the useful mechanism against "one-liner" posts or just simply filled out applications without proper IC letter on a storefront?"
Maltropia - Today at 7:25 PM
Aforementioned letter-writing guide - forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic.php?p=7030363#p7030363 - bit dated now, but it gives you an idea of the minimum expectations.
Kyrusia - Today at 7:26 PM
Q7: Have a roleplayed response be a requirement for involvement, just like you would any other thread. If that doesn't work, you can always request their posts be removed. We get a fair share of these requests in the Mod megathreads relevant to them.
Lamoni - Today at 7:26 PM
^
And state it clearly in your storefront, so that people know!(edited)
Make it visible.
Maltropia - Today at 7:27 PM
Q7: As Kyrusia says, one method is the "please only apply with a letter," and then proceeding to ignore anyone who fails that requirement. I don't like that, though, because it strikes me as unprofessional. Just because your customers don't meet the standard you'd like doesn't mean that you should be rude or fail to meet your own standards. Everyone deserves a polite and formal response, even if it's an IC version of "please write a letter next time and then we'll say yes."
Swith - Today at 7:27 PM
Question Eight posed by Nikolia - "Since Malt said "advertise like mad", what are the good ways of advertising your storefront(s)?"
Kyrusia - Today at 7:28 PM
Ones that don't involve spamming and giving the Mods more work. :stuck_out_tongue:
Maltropia - Today at 7:28 PM
Q8: Depending on how you look at this, it could be either boring-copy-paste time or awesome-sneak-peek-of-my-Guide time:
"Go out to relevant storefronts and offer them your product. If you run a ship-building company, look for shipping companies. If you sell handwoven baskets, look for companies that sell shampoos or fruit. Sometimes you might look to establish a long-term partnership with that storefront, and become the sole supplier of baskets to Fruits'R'Us. Other times you might just want to make a once-off sale, possibly hoping to get a repeat customer out of them but not expecting to sell more than three tugboats.
Sometimes there can be a fine line between advertising and spam. It's important that your posts be relevant to the threads where you put them: you wouldn't advertise an airport to an arms dealer, most likely, or vice versa. Engage with the storefront. Don't just post an advertisement, write a letter. Even if you copy-paste that letter every subsequent time you use it and only change a few of the words around, it makes you look better and it makes the storefront you're posting on it look better.
In fact, you should strive to always include a cover letter in GE&T, whether you're making an inquiry, selling a boat, applying for an airline route or accepting someone's order. It's good business and good etiquette. "
Kyrusia - Today at 7:28 PM
(Also, sigs are your friend.)
Macabees - Today at 7:29 PM
Q8: I think as Mal had said in an earlier question, the best form of marketing is relationship building, or networking. It's not just true on NS, but in RL too. When I build a strategy for a client to market on social media, what that really means is that I build them an approach to building a community around the product that they sell. A community where they're not selling, though, but instead they're adding value. If you add enough value, you will sell without having to hard sell.
Maltropia - Today at 7:29 PM
^
I've had people come to me (hi, @tect!) to buy from my storefronts because they remembered that I had storefronts selling something they should buy. Friendship truly is magic.
Lamoni - Today at 7:30 PM
1.) Don't be afraid to advertise your storefront in your signature. 2.) Seek out companies on GE&T who would likely buy your product, and offer it to them via TG. 3.) Relationship build! 4.) If you see a thread on GE&T where someone is asking for your type of product, feel free to respond in that thread.
Swith - Today at 7:30 PM
Question Nine posed by Jutomi~ [restructured by mod] - "What makes a player a good customer, and what are some habits that make players a bad customer?"
Kyrusia - Today at 7:31 PM
Q9: One that is in it for more than adding n-number of tanks to their spreadsheet, or more than buying "OVER 9,000! SHOOTY-SHOOTIES!" One that treats the storefront as it should be: like any other roleplay.
For bad? ...That should be obvious. :stuck_out_tongue:
Macabees - Today at 7:31 PM
Q9: Not summing up the total value of their orders. That was one my personal pet peeves . Maybe it was just me.
Maltropia - Today at 7:33 PM
Q9: A good customer, to me, is someone who reads the storefront, puts work into his letters and considers his IC reasons for going through with whatever purchase or action he's undertaking.
A bad customer fails to meet those criteria; repeated, low-quality posts, or posts for the sake of posting, which some storefront owners might accept as free bumps but which others might see as diminishing the overall quality and appearance of the storefront. We get snobby about our own stuff sometimes.
Lamoni - Today at 7:33 PM
Q9: You aren't alone there, Mac. A customer should really avoid one-liners like the plague, though. Like we said earlier, please, please, please put effort into your orders! Second, be polite, and realize that this isn't about putting X number of tanks (or whatever) into slot Y of your personal spreadsheet. A good customer will read the storefront, reads the product descriptions, and considers all this in light of their IC needs.
Kyrusia - Today at 7:33 PM
I'd rather have 3 quality orders, than 30 one-liners worth of bump-spam and more "profit."
Swith - Today at 7:34 PM
Question Ten posed by Ceneria - "Last year (before I dropped off the earth for a bit), I noticed there was an increasing movement of storefronts which did not include order forms. The stated goal of many of these storefronts was to encourage potential customers to RP a letter to the storefront regarding their order. Do you think this is an effective way to encourage RP within the GE&T community, and if so, what sort of balance do you think exists between risking alienating newcomers by not having forms and encouraging IC interactions by requiring formal letters?"
Maltropia - Today at 7:37 PM
Q10: Oh, that's a nice question. I think it's for the better, generally, but I can see downsides too. The lack of order forms means that you can't take the easy way out and make a drive-by purchase (a drive-buy?) where you copy-paste a form, lazily fill in your name and a number and then never revisit it. I like to think that it's led to me getting more out of my own storefront-management, since my responses nowadays nearly always include some unique lines in them responding to something contained in the applications.
Of course, it might also have the drawback of reducing activity since the lazier people (of which I'm often one, not gonna lie) have to spend more time engaging than they really care to.
Swith - Today at 7:37 PM
Question 11 posed by Nikolia - "Are there some formatting tricks panelists commonly use?"
Lamoni - Today at 7:37 PM
The reason why forms were first put into storefronts was to give people a reason to do more than just post one-liners. So to expand on that and require IC letters and such is simply taking it a step beyond that. You (hopefully) wouldn't post a one-liner response in the middle of someone's roleplay, so why do it in GE&T? The community should strive for more. On the other hand, it will reduce activity.
Kyrusia - Today at 7:37 PM
Q11: Transparencies in graphics! xD
Maltropia - Today at 7:37 PM
Q11: I said specific formatting questions, Nik! This is too vague!
Swith - Today at 7:38 PM
laughs
Maltropia - Today at 7:40 PM
I love blocktext and align=justify, as I said in an earlier panel. I use them just about everywhere and almost always together, from narrative prose to government communiques. I also use anchor and various lists and links ([post] is a nice, clean link-maker) to construct my navigation bars and tables of contents.
The [ hr][/ hr] code is a great one, as well, for tidying up storefronts, as are things like box and the floatleft/right commands. I dislike tables because they're not very flexible and a lot of people misuse them, but I have seen them put to fantastic use.
Font size is also something worth fiddling with; it's scientifically proven that 50% of storefronts could be improved by being font size 105%.
Swith - Today at 7:40 PM
Question Twelve posed by Eridani Imperium - "What's the panelists' advice on making products to sell?"
Lamoni - Today at 7:43 PM
Take the time to research what you're selling first (even if it is a "rule of cool" product). Secondly ask yourself: "is this going to be something that I will enjoy making for sale?" Products in which serious thought are put into them are always better than products where thought was clearly not put into them. Third, don't just sell RL weapons. There is a rule of thumb on NS and GE&T that everyone has access to RL weapons if they have a good backstory for how they got them, so there is no need for a GE&T storefront to sell them. In other words, make something original.
Maltropia - Today at 7:43 PM
Q12: Write what you know. Don't try to sell something about which you know nothing. I've made that mistake a few times; the storefront looks great until someone comes along asking how the product works and I just have to shrug maniacally.
Swith - Today at 7:43 PM
Question Thirteen is in two parts:
13A posed by Tilt - "How much crossover is there between GE&T and another board? For example, as tied to politics."
13B posed by Ched - "Following up Tilt's question, should a storefront's success or failure affect a nation elsewhere in N&I?"
Kyrusia - Today at 7:45 PM
A particular blockade, anyone?
Maltropia - Today at 7:45 PM
Yeah, I'm thinking it too Kyrusia .
Lamoni - Today at 7:45 PM
It depends on the person running the storefront. While it is one company (or conglomerate) out of many of them that your nation likely has, it can also be a form of advertising if you have a good newspaper or TV News thread, and make posts about your storefront. Yes, also "a particular blockcade."
Maltropia - Today at 7:46 PM
Q13A: It's up to you. Most of my storefronts on the nation Maltropia are just going towards creating a complete picture of Maltropia and have had very little to do with its political development (although my military allies have been known to buy from my storefronts; that's probably more 'networking' again), but in my nation of Cadenza the only storefront is the chamber of commerce bringing in foreign investors. That one thread has defined Cadenza's economy and its position within the region more than anything else I've done with the place.
Swith - Today at 7:47 PM
A quick request for clarification: Storefronts are mostly companies founded within your NS nation, correct? There might be a few public sector things, but it's mostly private industry?
Maltropia - Today at 7:47 PM
Q13B: Considering that everything in NS is collaborative and cooperative - it's up to other people. There was a blockade some years back within a prominent region that led to a prominent GE&Ter closing down his bank, and the IC repercussions were immense. Those repercussions were all consensual by dozens of nations, but you can't force anyone to take a hit just because you did.
Yeah, more or less, though you'd be surprised how often government ministries and military tenders feature.
Kyrusia - Today at 7:48 PM
I'd say it's a mixed bag. I've seen quite a few public/public-private partnership storefronts.
Maltropia - Today at 7:48 PM
My brain just tried to deny the existence of the public sector.
Lamoni - Today at 7:48 PM
Maltropia - Today at 7:48 PM
I'm too libertarian.
Swith - Today at 7:49 PM
Question Fourteen posed by Ceneria - "For at least some storefronts, keeping in the public eye requires being on the first page of the subforum. How can a storefront owner go about bumping their storefront without posting blantantly obvious bumps, or (even better), how can one keep their storefront's name out there even if it falls off to 4+ pages back?"
Kyrusia - Today at 7:49 PM
Shhh. It's okay, Malt. Your inner Austrian will survive.
Q14: Actually "bump" with pertinent content.
A well-written advertisement, announcement of a sale or discount period, something that makes a qualitative addition to the experience and the thread as a whole. That goes for pretty much any "bumps" on NS.
Maltropia - Today at 7:50 PM
Q14: Kyrusia's explained in the main chat that my favourite method of bumping is possibly a warnable offence, so uhhhh
Lamoni - Today at 7:50 PM
Once you get to a certain point, word of mouth takes over, and people will remember your storefront through thick and thin. The hard part, is reaching that level.
Swith - Today at 7:51 PM
Another request for clarification: "Wot's a 'particular blockade'?"
Maltropia - Today at 7:51 PM
If you have GE&T friends (or non-GE&Ters!) there's nothing wrong with asking them to post in your storefront, no more than there is with inviting someone to join your roleplay. If you need a bump that doesn't look like it came from you, ask someone. Heck, ask me if you want.
Kyrusia - Today at 7:51 PM
shoves everyone else to answer the clarifying one.
Maltropia - Today at 7:51 PM
falls and hurts himself
Lamoni - Today at 7:51 PM
falls to the ground
Swith - Today at 7:52 PM
crickets Anybody? :stuck_out_tongue:
There we go!
Lamoni - Today at 7:53 PM
Kyru was going to answer that question.
Maltropia - Today at 7:53 PM
bleeds as Kyrusia types
Kyrusia - Today at 7:53 PM
The blockade, as I recall, involved the termination of a certain bank's business, resulting in the near-total financial collapse of MT/PMT NS due to the storefront's popularity. This resulted of an attempting invasion of the region the bank owner was in. At least if I remember correctly. It's been a long time.(edited)
Big community event thing.
Maltropia - Today at 7:54 PM
Someone got absolutely glassed in the same thread.
i.e. nukes.
Kyrusia - Today at 7:54 PM
I'm sure others can provide greater details.
Swith - Today at 7:54 PM
Question Fifteen posed by Ched - [mod rephrasing] "How sensible is it for someone to make a puppet nation just to have a storefront, like an East India Company? Could making one be over doing it?"
Maltropia - Today at 7:55 PM
I think it's a bit silly, but some very successful storefronts have done it. Not a huge number, mind you.
I do have 70 puppets, though, so my opinion here is hilarious.
Kyrusia - Today at 7:55 PM
Q15: I've seen it done and, personally, it doesn't really bother me. Though I do hate when people do it and provide no indication as to where the company originates.
Macabees - Today at 7:56 PM
Q15: Maybe a bit tangential, but I do know players who run parts of their nation as they would a storefront - for example, their entire militaries might be private military corps that they rent out to people.
Swith - Today at 7:56 PM
Question Sixteen posed by Nikolia - "How do you see the importance of good graphical illustrations on storefronts, and how they can impact sales?"
Lamoni - Today at 7:57 PM
Good graphics on your storefront can REALLY increase sales. They are like candy or crack for the eyes.
Kyrusia - Today at 7:57 PM
^
Macabees - Today at 7:57 PM
Q16: I feel that they do impact sales quite a bit. I'm not a very good drawer, but for a while I was getting pretty good at drawing tanks (I was no Anemos, mind you) and if the drawing was good people would order it before I had even written anything.
Kyrusia - Today at 7:58 PM
LEGAL ADDICTIVE GRAPHICS. APPLY DIRECTLY TO THE CORNEA.
LEGAL ADDICTIVE GRAPHICS. APPLY DIRECTLY TO THE CORNEA.
LEGAL ADDICTIVE GRAPHICS. APPLY DIRECTLY TO THE CORNEA.
Maltropia - Today at 7:58 PM
Q16: I think good graphics can be make-or-break for a lot of storefronts. Back when I was starting out a "good" storefront only needed one or two pictures, but nowadays it's the standard to not only have pretty pictures but to have made the graphics yourself. Ask yourself whether you'd rather buy from a website written only in the HTML a guy learned on his first day or from a modern graphic designer-designed website; the difference isn't quite that startling, but it's often the storefronts with good graphics that also have good written content, so they're barometers for each other.
Swith - Today at 7:59 PM
Question Seventeen posed by Tilt [clarified by mod] - "Sometimes in P2TM we see parodies. Is it possible in GE&T to parody a real world store and/or parody a real world product. If so, how? Best one seen?"
THIRTY MINUTES, GUESTS
Maltropia - Today at 7:59 PM
Q18: @akimonad had uneasyJet. I was a fan.(edited)
Maltropia - Today at 8:00 PM
18? I'm turning into Swith. 17*.
Kyrusia - Today at 8:00 PM
Wasn't there a storefront dedicated entirely to selling No.2 pencils?
Lamoni - Today at 8:01 PM
Someone else had an airline where people were packed into the plane like cattle, and there were no seats, too.
And yes, Kyru. There was.
There was also the "Tactical Rock."
Maltropia - Today at 8:01 PM
Milograd had a very successful storefront for a while selling the Tactical Rock. Parodies of RL concepts and businesses aren't rare, and when done right they can be hilarious. Absolutely worth giving a go.
Swith - Today at 8:01 PM
Question Eighteen posed by Esc - "If one mark of a good storefront is creating an air of authenticity, what information or elements have you found to be most crucial?"
Maltropia - Today at 8:04 PM
Q18: There are a few sections I think every storefront needs, just as a starting point. "About Us"/"History", a catalogue, ordering/pricing information; those are fundamental, to me, but GE&T is about thinking outside the box and I wouldn't be surprised if someone here went and made a fantastic storefront that managed to include none of those.
Swith - Today at 8:04 PM
Question Nineteen posed by Nikolia - "What are the panelists' opinions on having a separate thread (or threads) as catalogues of products?"
Kyrusia - Today at 8:05 PM
Q19: I'm not a huge fan of having individual threads for individual products. For sections of products in a storefront, though, such as an actual catalogue, I don't mind. I've seen them used fairly successfully.
Maltropia - Today at 8:06 PM
Q19: I'm not sure if I've ever done it, but I see no problem with it when it's not done to extremes. Some miltech guys like to do an individual thread for each tank - but those tanks have write-ups in the tens of thousands of words, and putting two tanks in one thread would be surprisingly cluttered. Generally speaking I think one external catalogue is the most you need. I usually keep it all in the one thread, personally.
Swith - Today at 8:06 PM
Question Twenty posed by Ceneria - "If you had the opportunity to give single piece of advice to every new storefront owner about making their storefront better than average, what would it be? Coding? Content? Style?"
Lamoni - Today at 8:06 PM
All of the above? :wink:
Kyrusia - Today at 8:07 PM
Q20: Don't be upset if your first ten storefronts fail. Keep at it. Keep practicing.(edited)
Lamoni - Today at 8:07 PM
But seriously, you want to make your storefront catch the customer's eye, while having the content to keep them coming back.
Maltropia - Today at 8:08 PM
The key to success in GE&T is experimentation. There are dotted lines you can colour inside, if you want, but it's easy enough to colour over them. There are plenty of boxes in GE&T, and you're free to think outside any and all of them. See what works for other people and then see what works for you.
Swith - Today at 8:08 PM
Question Twenty-One posed by Ched - "What were some notable storefronts you can recall for being either good or bad, and why?"
Maltropia - Today at 8:10 PM
Q20: I don't want to name names in relation to either, actually, because some of the best storefronts were made by people who subsequently tore them up and set a not-so-great example.
Lamoni - Today at 8:10 PM
^
Maltropia - Today at 8:10 PM
Eslovakia's Karlberg AB was a magnificent storefront, though. Serious graphic work there supporting some great products.
Swith - Today at 8:11 PM
Question Twenty-Two posed by Ceneria - "What has been the best community interaction that you've experienced in your time RPing in GE&T?"
Maltropia - Today at 8:12 PM
Q22: I briefly revived the "Bureau for the Improvement of NS Business", or whatever its name was, a while ago, and it was great to see the veterans of the community all chip in to offer advice and help to anyone who asked for it.
Other side of that coin: I've sued people a few times and gotten really snarky about it, IC. Great times there.
Lamoni - Today at 8:12 PM
Time to bring the Bureau back, Malt.
Swith - Today at 8:12 PM
Request for clarification: "Sue? Is there an NS court?"
Lamoni - Today at 8:13 PM
No, it is all done IC.
Maltropia - Today at 8:13 PM
Well, rather, I've had my companies' lawyers shout down other people.
Some regions do have courts, but I've never seen one used in a GE&T context. Now there's a nice idea...
Kyrusia - Today at 8:14 PM
The glories of an IC cease and desist. For the record though... If it's actually actionable, report it, don't sue. :stuck_out_tongue:
Swith - Today at 8:14 PM
Question Twenty-Three posed by Lubyak - "Storefronts are the most popular way of engaging in GE&T. Do you think there's potential for other forms of engagement? (i.e. Freed trade organizations, customs unions, investment treaties, etc.)"
Kyrusia - Today at 8:15 PM
Q23: I've seen the occasional organizational threads in GE&T; I think they're sometimes a mixed bag in terms of quality, however, but I would definitely say there is room for them.
Maltropia - Today at 8:15 PM
Q23: I've participated in the odd trade summit in GE&T, actually. Yeah, plenty of room for it and no reason not to try; the only issue is that there isn't quite the culture behind them to give them a helpful head start, so it might be an uphill battle if you're aspiring.(edited)
13? Jeez.
Swith - Today at 8:16 PM
Question Twenty-Four posed by Ched - "Are trade wars a thing that happen often in GE&T? And do some players add conflict like for example having their workers do a general strike?" [Would such a strike be played out in GE&T subforum or in the N&I RP subs?](edited)
Kyrusia - Today at 8:16 PM
Q23: If it's a war, I'd say it need be played out in II, much like the blockade and subsequent actions were.
An actual war, I should clarify.
Since resource wars are a thing.
Maltropia - Today at 8:17 PM
Q24: Jeez none of us can get numbers right. I don't really see that happen. Again, I think the culture of GE&T has evolved into a storefront focus and could possibly do with some steering away from that. Actual conflict doesn't really belong in GE&T, but interactions with storefronts probably almost universally do.
Swith - Today at 8:18 PM
Question Twenty-Five posed by PM - "Is there such a thing on GE&T as a 'saturated' market, where people just don't want to see another thread selling [x product]?"(edited)
Maltropia - Today at 8:19 PM
Q25: Considering the longevity of the airport/line craze? Probably not. Very often, though, someone comes up with something no one's doing (even something as 'mainstream' as supermarkets) and suddenly half a dozen copycats emerge before they all drop off the face of the earth.
Kyrusia - Today at 8:20 PM
Suddenly not!Starbucks. Suddenly not!Starbucks everywhere.
Swith - Today at 8:20 PM
Question Twenty-Six posed by Ched - "What's your favorite part of GE&T?"
Maltropia - Today at 8:22 PM
Q26: The creativity of its members. I've seen some wonderfully innovative storefronts in my years in GE&T, and some brilliantly-designed ways of selling products. It's amazing how just about anything can be made tantalising by a good storefront and good storefront-owner.
Lamoni - Today at 8:23 PM
Same
Swith - Today at 8:23 PM
FINAL QUESTION posed by PM - "Can you link an example of your own storefront, and why you're proud of it, or tell us things you wish you could have done better?"
Maltropia - Today at 8:23 PM
FQ: Yes I can. Will I, though?
forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=390466
This is T-O Cartographic. It's the first new storefront I've made in about three, four years now, after a long lull. It's probably not my best but it's the one I'm proudest of, even though it's not yet gotten a customer. It's 95% finished, but I took so long getting to this point that it's about twenty pages back so no one's seen it without me shoving it in their faces. It's probably the most realistic storefront I've made, partly because it's based on my own experiences as a geography student. I wish I could figure out a third paragraph for "Our Innovation" though. :stuck_out_tongue:
Swith - Today at 8:26 PM
Thanks, Malt!
Thank you, Panelists! This wraps up tonight's 7PM panel.
Our upcoming schedule:
Tonight:
Worldbuilding and Related (Late Hour) — 9PM Eastern/1AM GMT
NS Roleplay Symposium 2017
TOPIC: "Global Economics & Trade: A Primer”
TIME: COMPLETED